The Dim-Post

February 4, 2011

Not

Filed under: Uncategorized — danylmc @ 7:39 am
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Lew is on fire these days:

Don’t cuss out the media — Labour knows (or should know) how they work, and have in the past proven adept at playing the game. You single out the Veitch interview as a case where Key received an unjustified profile and character boost. I covered this in my post, did you read it? That Key felt emboldened to do that indicates he is cognisant of the opposition’s inability to present a credible threat. Instead of blaming the media for doing what the media does, ask yourself this: how, in New Zealand in 2011, does the Prime Minister get all matesy-blokey with one of the country’s best-known wife-beaters and not get crucified by the opposition for doing so? After all — it’s not the media’s job to crucify him; and goodness knows the National party isn’t going to crucify itself. Only one bunch of people has responsibility for bringing the wood and the nails, and banging them all together, and that’s the opposition. They didn’t even try; the only response was from an isolated 70s feminist from a minor party who’s widely regarded as a bit of a crank and is retiring at the end of the year in any case. Nobody is to blame for that absence of response but Labour.

Of course, Goff did speak on this issue yesterday:

Labour leader Phil Goff said Liz Hurley “was pretty close” to being on his top five hot women list.

Today is Goff’s wedding anniversary and he put his wife Mary in the number one spot.

He said Elle Macpherson and Julia Roberts would also feature in his top five, “all being totally hypothetical of course”.

I bet Goff is one of those guys with hundreds of books on ‘leadership’ on the bookshelves in his office.

UPDATE: Milt comments:

I … suspect the “sports boofhead” demographic to be a lot larger than you think.

I think that’s Goff’s attitude too. He is aware that his party has terrible numbers amongst male voters. And sure, there are a lot of rugby heads out there who think Tony Veitch is a hero and that breaking your girlfriends back and then using your wealth and celebrity to try and destroy her life is awesome – but how many of them are persuadable voters for the Labour Party? I think that number is close to zero. The number of National leaning centre voters – particularly female voters – who think that Veitch is evil, and that a Prime Minister who goes on his show and talks about fucking Jessica Alba is a jerk? Quarter of a million? More? But for Key to lose their votes, Goff would have to show some leadership on the ‘issue’. Instead he proved that he is also basically a jerk, and also a spineless jerk (‘I’d nail the same chick the PM would, oh and also my wife!’) which makes him even less attractive as a leader.

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55 Comments »

  1. “…the only response was from an isolated 70s feminist from a minor party”

    He said it himself. No-one cares. Goff’s advisors would have noted this fact and made the judgement that, rather than criticising, he might as well join the club.

    Not really leadership, is it, but hey! When did we last see leadership in this country?

    Comment by Neil — February 4, 2011 @ 8:34 am

  2. I’m more concerned about the fact Key has taken to wearing a holographic wristband that optimises the bodies energy flow.

    That’s got to be bad for Phil Goff.

    Comment by ieuan — February 4, 2011 @ 8:37 am

  3. Neil writes: “No-one cares.”

    As Macdoctor replied to me yesterday, “I … suspect the “sports boofhead” demographic to be a lot larger than you think.”

    Comment by Psycho Milt — February 4, 2011 @ 8:40 am

  4. Sweet baby jesus.

    I’m more than a little ambivalent as to whether it’s a leftofrightofcentre or a rightofleftofcentre party in the driving seat…. but an opposition that at least TRIES is something important.

    This is bad for NZ

    (is the ‘this is bad for…’ meme ever going to die?)

    Comment by TBwood — February 4, 2011 @ 8:56 am

  5. I bet Goff is one of those guys with hundreds of books on ‘leadership’ on the bookshelves in his office.

    I bet Goff doesn’t really understand why David Brent in the “The Office” is funny.

    Comment by eszett — February 4, 2011 @ 9:10 am

  6. is the ‘this is bad for…’ meme ever going to die?

    Fast-forward to November 27th:

    This is bad for the ‘this is bad for Phil Goff’ meme.

    Comment by Phil — February 4, 2011 @ 9:11 am

  7. there are a lot of rugby heads out there who think Tony Veitch is a hero and that breaking your girlfriends back and then using your wealth and celebrity to try and destroy her life is awesome

    That’s just really nasty, Danyl. You need to get out of the lab more.

    Comment by Phil — February 4, 2011 @ 9:13 am

  8. This is good for Michelle Boag and Guillaume Anglais (2002 edition)

    compared to Phil’s staff and Phil, they look positively Napoleonic on the political stage

    Comment by Leopold — February 4, 2011 @ 9:20 am


  9. Wait what?
    Pointing out the evil sh*t that asshats do is nasty, but condoning the evil asshattery is something no-one cares about?

    Comment by greg — February 4, 2011 @ 9:22 am

  10. Phil: it’s probably true.

    Comment by derp de derp — February 4, 2011 @ 9:27 am

  11. “No one cares”….in NZ. Didnt the daily mail/sun/national inquirer find our primeminister’s “id fuck that list” interesting and run a story on it for the British public?

    Comment by k.jones — February 4, 2011 @ 9:29 am

  12. PS – Praying frantically that someone dosent offer Phil a RWC outfit – another ‘me too’ moment too much to bear

    Comment by Leopold — February 4, 2011 @ 10:00 am

  13. I think that’s Goff’s attitude too.

    I’ll also credit Goff with some long-term memory. Did anyone stop voting Labour because Helen Clark kept up her weekly slot on Paul Holmes’ Newstalk ZB show after his infamous “cheeky darkie” mouth-fart? Nor do I recall any Labour politician (including Clark) declining an invite to appear on Breakfast because of Paul Henry’s rolling maul of douche-baggery.

    Comment by Craig Ranapia — February 4, 2011 @ 10:15 am

  14. No one thinks that Veitch is a hero, but I suspect too many men think he’s a decent bloke who did something that (in his words) “was certainly not me” and has paid for it; that 300 hours of community service means you can forget the past.

    Graham Henry wrote Veitch a character reference before the trial. Afterwards he said: “I don’t condone what happened – it was a terrible act – and I would be concerned if any of my comments were misconstrued. I provided a character reference for him based on the relationship I had with him professionally and my knowledge of the work he had done with sporting clubs and charities.”

    The problem is not that men think Veitch is awesome. The problem is that a lot of men — including, it appears, Key — don’t see any problem in Veitch resuming his career in broadcasting.

    Comment by bradluen — February 4, 2011 @ 10:24 am

  15. I’m reasonably sure ‘Craig Ranapia’ is a php bot endlessly spamming the nz blogosphere with infinite, pseudo-random ‘what about Helen Clark?’ counterfactuals.

    Comment by danylmc — February 4, 2011 @ 10:34 am

  16. It wouldn’t surprise me that most people have an “I’d fuck that list” – IN THEIR HEADS. Hearing other people’s lists in the media is another matter, and when it comes to our elected representatives, that’s another thing again. These dorks are supposed to be our ‘leaders’.

    Christ what an asshole x 2

    Comment by Joshua — February 4, 2011 @ 10:35 am

  17. “Paul Henry’s rolling maul of douche-baggery” – classic.

    Goff will regret joining Key in a scrum of lust.

    Comment by Philoff — February 4, 2011 @ 10:47 am

  18. Perhaps I missed the memo, but when was it decreed that convicted criminals weren’t allowed to work in their previous field after completing their court-imposed sentence?

    Im pretty sure most commenters here aren’t SST members, so what is driving the vindictiveness? And please don’t go with “Veitch is an eeevil scumbag”, because no-one is arguing that what he did was ok. But surely even asshats are allowed to earn a living?

    Comment by Andy — February 4, 2011 @ 10:53 am

  19. Perhaps I missed the memo, but when was it decreed that convicted criminals weren’t allowed to work in their previous field after completing their court-imposed sentence?

    What?

    Comment by danylmc — February 4, 2011 @ 11:05 am

  20. Yeah, I could have made that clearer. No one here has explicitly made that argument, but Im uneasy with comments like Bradluen’s above:

    “The problem is not that men think Veitch is awesome. The problem is that a lot of men — including, it appears, Key — don’t see any problem in Veitch resuming his career in broadcasting.”

    Its a theme I’ve seen in quite a number of comments in threads here and on PAS – never mind the PM talking to Veitch, How is Veitch even allowed to have a job!!1! I just find it a bit odd.

    Comment by Andy — February 4, 2011 @ 11:20 am

  21. Yeah, I could have made that clearer. No one here has explicitly made that argument, but Im uneasy with comments like Bradluen’s above:

    “The problem is not that men think Veitch is awesome. The problem is that a lot of men — including, it appears, Key — don’t see any problem in Veitch resuming his career in broadcasting.”

    Its a theme I’ve seen in quite a number of comments in threads here and on PAS – never mind the PM talking to Veitch, How is Veitch even allowed to have a job!!1! I just find it a bit odd.

    Comment by Andy — February 4, 2011 @ 11:22 am

  22. Far as I’m concerned Veitch can have his job back if the folk at Radio Sport want to take that risk on — but the PM should not be seen to endorse him. Different standards are required and expected from leaders. Paraphrasing TOby from The West Wing “You’re the President. You’re not ‘just folks’.”

    L

    Comment by Lew — February 4, 2011 @ 11:25 am

  23. Veitch has the right to employment, and he’s legally free to do any job he wants, but there are plenty of jobs that don’t involve being a public figure.

    I don’t really expect Veitch to understand this, but I would’ve hoped that, for example, Radio Sport would have.

    Comment by bradluen — February 4, 2011 @ 11:37 am

  24. Actually people do care. I can’t judge myself because I hate john Key’s policies so much it affects my judgement of the man. But personally I don’t have a “list” in my head because i don’t want to have sex with people I don’t know and probably wouldn’t like if I met them just because of the way they look. I think an awful lot of NZ women (and men) probably feel the same way.

    I had dinner last night with a bunch of women who probably mainly voted Labour in 2008. They were all agreed that a) it’s creepy to talk to Tony Veitch about who you’d like to shag and b) it’s just weird and inappropriate for the PM to go on Tony Veitch’s show full stop. They also all agreed that a) Helen Clark would never have done regular interviews with Tony Veitch and b) if he’d asked her that question she would have savaged him and then started talking about how Labour was helping to close the gender pay gap and actual policies and stuff…

    I’m not sure if those things are true but surely these women are a core Labour voting demographic? why piss them off?

    Comment by AWoman — February 4, 2011 @ 11:38 am

  25. Even if Phil Goff did attack Key over this you would be slaming his response. Goff isn’t going to do anything you like. He never has and he never will.

    Comment by K2 — February 4, 2011 @ 11:59 am

  26. If Goff had slammed Key and Veitch, how would Duncan Garner have reported it? Guyon Espiner?

    Comment by DT — February 4, 2011 @ 12:30 pm

  27. Goff isn’t going to do anything you like. He never has and he never will.

    Here’s what I wrote when Phil Goff took over as Labour leader:

    I think Goff will be outstanding – as an opposition leader he is Key’s worst nightmare incarnate – but he’ll have a huge challenge ahead of him; his enemies in the party will try to role him if he loses in 2011 and New Zealanders are very reluctant to change governments after just one term.

    http://dimpost.wordpress.com/2008/11/09/rumour-mill/

    Like most of what I write, history has proved me utterly wrong. But you can’t say I wasn’t well disposed towards Goff.

    Comment by danylmc — February 4, 2011 @ 12:31 pm

  28. I can’t really get my pretty little head around all this politics business, so I can’t say whether Phil Goff is doing a good job or not.

    Luckily, there are wise ‘political commentators’ to help me out:

    http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/newsdetail1.asp?storyid=190173

    In other news, second-hand car salesman says the one on the forecourt is “just right for you”. Thanks mate, give me the keys!

    Comment by sammy — February 4, 2011 @ 12:43 pm

  29. Maybe, just maybe, the internet beltway is completely out of touch? the latest Roy Morgan has a big drop in support for National:

    “..The latest New Zealand Roy Morgan Poll shows support for John Key’s National-led Government has fallen to 53% (down 6.5%). Support for Prime Minister Key’s National Party is 49% (down 6%), the Maori Party 3% (up 0.5%) and ACT NZ 1% (down 0.5%).

    Support for Opposition Parties has risen to 47% (up 6.5%) with the Labour Party 34.5% (up 5.5%), Greens 6.5%, (down 0.5%), New Zealand First 5.5% (up 1% – and now at their highest since mid 2008) and others 0.5% (up 0.5%).

    If a National Election were held today the National Party would be returned to Government.

    The Roy Morgan Government Confidence Rating has fallen 3 points to 129.5 with 57% (down 2.5%) of New Zealanders saying New Zealand is ‘heading in the right direction’ compared to 27.5% (up 0.5%) that say New Zealand is ‘heading in the wrong direction.’…”

    Note that this poll only included four days of the period after Key announced his privatisation agenda.

    Comment by Sanctuary — February 4, 2011 @ 3:02 pm

  30. Off topic: thanks Danyl MC for coming back after your break and keeping Dim post alive. There’s been some really excellent info/banter/insight/giggles so far already….

    Comment by k.jones — February 4, 2011 @ 3:08 pm

  31. And running the numbers (assuming Jimbob, Rodders, and the bouffant boy all win their seats), it gives NACT+UF 61 seats, L+G+NZF+PROG 57 with the Maori Party on 4 seats…

    Comment by Sanctuary — February 4, 2011 @ 3:11 pm

  32. Sanc, cool. Looks like a rogue, but things are about to get very interesting if it’s not. Few things would make me happier than being forced to eat my words.

    L

    Comment by Lew — February 4, 2011 @ 3:42 pm

  33. Not only all of that, but you also weaken your base. You make those feminist-leaning activists who otherwise comprise a fairly strong component of Labour’s membership. The people who will hand out your leaflets in the freezing cold for nothing other than the notion that it’s the right thing to be doing.

    That’s one lesson that the Democrats are teaching us all very clearly (if it wasn’t completely obvious already, after the NZLP disaster of the early 1990s). You lose your activists, you don’t have a party. You’re in opposition for years until you can rebuild with a new bunch of naive young folks.

    Comment by George D — February 4, 2011 @ 3:45 pm

  34. @danylmc: Could you DM me an English translation of what I’m sure is a withering slap-down?

    Comment by Craig Ranapia — February 4, 2011 @ 3:46 pm

  35. If Goff had slammed Key and Veitch, how would Duncan Garner have reported it? Guyon Espiner?

    Who knows.

    Comment by George D — February 4, 2011 @ 3:47 pm

  36. @ k.jones: Not sure about the British press, but the Irish Independent had a write-up about it, along the lines of “why can’t we have politicians like this?” I suppose being ruled by a vaguely sleazy bloke-ish boofhead is preferable to being ruled by a traitor who sold the country to the Germans and the bankers and the….etc, etc. The point of the article was that if this was all NZ had to worry about then wasn’t it an enviable country?

    Comment by Bearhunter — February 4, 2011 @ 3:53 pm

  37. Nope don’t believe the NZ First result. Sorry just don’t.

    Comment by gingercrush — February 4, 2011 @ 3:53 pm

  38. Far as I’m concerned Veitch can have his job back if the folk at Radio Sport want to take that risk on — but the PM should not be seen to endorse him.

    This is it, exactly. And he shouldn’t indulge in matey banter about the public scoring of women with someone with Veitch’s baggage. What a fool.

    And Goff? Jesus wept. He had the chance to do the right thing, and did the fucking opposite.

    Comment by Russell Brown — February 4, 2011 @ 3:55 pm

  39. And Goff? Jesus wept. He had the chance to do the right thing, and did the fucking opposite.

    Isn’t that Goff in a nutshell?

    Comment by Idiot/Savant — February 4, 2011 @ 3:58 pm

  40. “If Goff had slammed Key and Veitch, how would Duncan Garner have reported it? Guyon Espiner?”

    when I saw the words ‘slammed’ and ‘veitch’ in the same sentence, I imagined something rather more violent than the writer probably intended…

    Comment by kahitakea — February 4, 2011 @ 3:59 pm

  41. And they’re absolutely frothing at the mouth over John Key in World Cup gear at The Standard.

    Its all hilarious how truly pathetic and unhinged the left are getting about John Key. Its a repeat of the right’s frothing about Helen Clark. Neither of which will be successful.

    And so what if John Key is a fool. Most people in New Zealand don’t think so your opinion is irrelevant.

    Comment by gingercrush — February 4, 2011 @ 4:16 pm

  42. GC, the right’s frothing about Helen Clark was <extremely successful.

    (I agree it won’t work in reverse, though — lefties just suck at hate & vilification.)

    L

    Comment by Lew — February 4, 2011 @ 4:30 pm

  43. Gingercrush, I think you’ll find John Key’s catwalk is (en)grossing the entire internet.

    Comment by sammy — February 4, 2011 @ 4:40 pm

  44. Lew no it wasn’t. It took three terms to kick her out.

    Comment by gingercrush — February 4, 2011 @ 4:46 pm

  45. The media monitor, understand, and market the audience demographic, and it’s only when major advertisers/sponsors dislike adverse effects on their brand association that individual broadcasters actually get dropped.

    I may be wrong, but IIRC, that was the case with Veitch and Henry, however the dialogue is seldom public. Concerned people started emailing the advertisers.

    Comment by Bruce Hamilton — February 4, 2011 @ 5:25 pm

  46. Instead he proved that he is also basically a jerk, and also a spineless jerk (‘I’d nail the same chick the PM would, oh and also my wife!’)

    I want to know what fucking idiot thought that line would come off as anything other than pathetic and absurdly forced. If ever there were a time for Phil to pull out his trusty stern-glare-to-camera and say something a little contemptuous, this was it.

    Comment by QoT — February 4, 2011 @ 5:47 pm

  47. GC, but Clark and her govt weren’t so much thrown out for strong policy reasons as due to a vague but deep-seated sense of OMG FEMINAZI NANNY-STATE DYKOCRACY.

    I’m no apologist for the 5LG’s policy faings (and there were plenty). But the anti-Clark hate campaign worked just fine.

    L

    Comment by Lew — February 4, 2011 @ 6:28 pm

  48. There was reason for the ‘vague’ feminazi nanny state dykocracy mindset i.e. it was one.

    Comment by leon — February 4, 2011 @ 9:16 pm

  49. GC, I rest my case.

    L

    Comment by Lew — February 4, 2011 @ 9:50 pm

  50. Yeah, that works Lew. The country actually did vote Labour out on the basis of H.Clarks actual feminazi dykocracy it’s just not a PC line of discussion.

    Comment by leon — February 4, 2011 @ 10:05 pm

  51. Leon, if you were a little less parsimonious, I’d think you were a Redbaiter alter-ego.

    L

    Comment by Lew — February 4, 2011 @ 10:19 pm

  52. But the country did vote Labour out because of Helen and Michael and Trevor and Mike W’s power crazed idiocy, it doesn’t matter how you label it.

    Comment by leon — February 4, 2011 @ 11:12 pm

  53. I agree with most of the comments on this page. Goff should have taken the opportunity and didn’t. They both look like neanderthrals.

    Comment by Bored surfer who stumbled across this page — February 4, 2011 @ 11:14 pm

  54. Neanderthral – ancient man in thrall of Veitchy.

    Comment by leon — February 5, 2011 @ 8:31 am

  55. The Sisterhood abandoned Helen Clark in 2008 for “that nice Mr Key”. The men folk had already walked away in 2005.

    2011 is cake walk for National.

    John Key is so popular right now.

    Comment by OECD rank 22 kiwi — February 6, 2011 @ 12:16 am


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