The Dim-Post

August 14, 2011

Chart of the day, I was going to post pictures of my garden covered in snow instead but I couldn’t find my USB cord edition

Filed under: policy,Politics — danylmc @ 8:44 pm

Helpful to keep in mind that the number of people receiving this benefit targeted in Key’s new reforms is (a) pretty tiny and (b) tracks with unemployment rates.


  1. And apparently we want to crack down on these 1000 or so Independent Youth Benefit recipients, and stop them ‘choosing’ to go on the benefits… never mind that to qualify they have to prove that due to unusual circumstances (step-father touches them up type thing) they cannot live with their family. Its sledge hammer – walnut.

    Comment by DT — August 14, 2011 @ 8:50 pm

  2. Sledgehammer? That implies effort. This is just Joky Hen feeding the chooks again. The only chooks that matter – the susceptible “middle” voters. Whether or not this measure will have zero to miniscule effect on zero to minimal youth is utterly irrelevant; what matters is that the chooks gather a soundbite between reality shows and think “Ah good. Key’s putting the boot into those lazy druggie kids. About time, mmmmmmm……rugby….”

    Comment by ak — August 14, 2011 @ 9:43 pm

  3. They’ve created a 16 and 17 year old subgroup to receive the funding they cut from TOP’s.

    There is already a payment made rto those looking after 16 and 17 year olds (in place of parents) – it’s just not specifically for rent and power.

    Comment by SPC — August 14, 2011 @ 9:48 pm

  4. Divide that by $30m. If we add in the 700 who get EMA – not long term – or those who get DPB – a VERY small number, Key’s reform is going to cost a conservative $11,000 per IYB claimant in the first year. And then even more in consecutive years as the costs of putting them through education and training and paying for childcare and carries on paying them the same amount, only targeting it more toward spending on… well, not what he assumes what they’re spending it on now.

    Comment by Dizzy — August 14, 2011 @ 9:51 pm

  5. I agree with (a), which is an excellent point. But I’m afraid that (b) is total cobblers, on the evidence of your graph (there may be other, better, evidence, but this isn’t at all convincing). They are both flat in 2007 to 2008, and both increase in 2008-9, but otherwise don’t track together at all.

    Comment by Dr Foster — August 15, 2011 @ 12:06 am

  6. I think we should issue food stamps to those on national super as well – they should not be allowed to spend that state’s cash on ciggies and booze. Dearie me, no – some social discipline is required. Let the Natnanny state run amok!

    Comment by Snow-bound — August 15, 2011 @ 11:16 am

  7. The Herald quoted Key’s numbers that claim the reforms have a wider aim then just those currently receiving a benefit.
    Between 8500 and 13,500 16 and 17-year-olds are not in education, training, or work at any one time; 90 per cent of these people will go onto a benefit once they turn 18, and around 1600 are already on a special benefit for 16 and 17 year olds.

    Comment by questlovenz — August 15, 2011 @ 11:32 am

  8. Yes, and you might note that these reforms do fuck all for the majority of 16 and 17 year olds who’ll end up on a benefit at 18 – those who aren’t actually on a benefit right now.

    Comment by Dizzy — August 15, 2011 @ 12:44 pm

  9. The reforms aim to monitor and link with support services all 16-17 year olds not in education, training, or work regardless of whether they are on a benefit.

    Of course this doesn’t necessitate that they still won’t end up on a benefit.

    Comment by questlovenz — August 15, 2011 @ 8:07 pm

  10. They’re not on a benefit. Therefore they’re not beholden to the state for something they’re not currently receiving. Therefore there is no carrot, because nothing is given, and there is no stick because they have nothing you can reasonably take from them for failure to comply. At least not unless you’ve got a whole bunch of precogs mutating in your spa pool.

    Comment by Dizzy — August 15, 2011 @ 8:51 pm

  11. I would hazard a guess that a significant proportion – possibly a majority – of the 8000-13000 “missing” teens are special needs – and that is probably because we do a much poorer job of catering for them in secondary and tertiary education than in primary.

    Comment by Richard Grevers — August 15, 2011 @ 9:48 pm

  12. The statistics showing how tiny the target group is simply highlights the bleedin’ obvious – that this is a precursor for more to come, including extending the attacks across all beneficiary groups, and worryingly, setting the stage for reversion to Poor Law times. Was good to see how quick the commentators were to start saying these things.

    Comment by Anton — August 15, 2011 @ 11:20 pm

  13. […] approximately 1600 who receive the special Independent Youth benefit and the overall number is dropping relative to the overall employment rate.  The numbers of young on the D.P.B. is approximately 2400 and also seems to be falling for young […]

    Pingback by Who benefits? — August 16, 2011 @ 7:23 pm

  14. Anton has got it right.

    The Nats have always said they would not upset the natives in their first term.

    They have never stated what they would do if re elected.

    Now we have an inkling, apart from state assets which we all know they are going to flog off.

    John Key would be happy to make NZ a vassal of China or the US as long as the NZ Business Round Table is happy.

    That the rest of us are reduced 3rd world beggars and slaves is irrelevant.

    Comment by peterlepaysan — August 16, 2011 @ 11:15 pm

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